Building a Cruncher

[jmblazek]

Would someone please point me in the right direction for information on building a bare bones cruncher? I'm looking for absolute bare bones...only what's necessary.

Right now I think all I need is:

- Motherboard (network onboard)
- CPU
- RAM

I DON'T think I need:

- Video
- CD/DVD
- or any other peripheral

Will I need a separate PSU for each motherboard or can I run multiple boards off of one PSU? Do I need a HD for each cruncher? Does 1G RAM per cruncher cover pretty much all the DC projects? Do I need more or can I get by with less? Also, what software would be best suited for this type of arrangement?

Ideally I'd love to find a box that I could just mount motherboards into, plug in the power supply and network connections, and then remotely access each motherboard through a central PC. As I find more old hardware and new hardware, I want to "easily" add it on...pretty much plug and play. Is this possible???

I'm looking at old durons, PIIIs, and up.

If there's a HOW TO out there please provide the link to it.

[vaughan]

You will need an Operating System too.

You don't need more than one keyboard, monitor and mouse to "view" your network. There are hardware and software applications that solve this for you. Search for KVM switches and Remote Control Software (one I use is LogMeIn).

1GB RAM is enough for a cruncher.

The choice of motherboard depends on what CPU you select. Most entry level motherboards have on-board networking and video; search some of the motherboard manufacturer's sites.

That's a start for you.

ps. I'm building a cruncher at the moment:
Asrock 775-dual-VSTA motherboard (on-board video and networking)[on order]
1 GB DDR 400 RAM Corsair (dual channel)
80 GB SATA HDD Seagate
Intel C2D e6300 [on order]
Win XP Home
Generic case with 480W Antec power supply
This should be able to crunch BOINC Riesel Sieve tasks in about 45-50min or so.

[AMDave]

What you describe is a headless LTSP CPU Grid.It doesn't sound so complex but I've sure had fun trying to get mine to work last year.

How to build your own Screwball Farm - AMD Forums
(http://forums.amd.com/index.php?showtopic=53542)
EXTREME Overclocking - Building A Diskless Folding @ Home Farm Article - Page: 1 - Tweaking PC Hardware To The Max (http://www.extremeoverclocking.com/articles/howto/FAH_Diskless_Farm_1.html)

In my case it came down to incompatible hardware. I haven't given up. Just waiting for funds and the right hardware.

Otherwise, I have 4 machines next to my desk, but only 1 has Keyboard, mouse and VDU. I use that one to remote connect to the other 3 using Xvnc or SSH and SFT as I require. It's just a matter of configuring them for secure remote access first, then unplugging the K+M+V and plugging them back into the workstation. I use fixed IP addresses. Nice and simple. The more you mess about with this stuff the more you learn and it's great fun at the same time.

[Big Whiskey]

'Diskless computers' or 'diskless nodes' is where to starting seaching

you don't even need boxes Pics (http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=128307)

I seen a pic of one farm, he attached the mobo's to peg board on the wall and had the PSU's sitting on a shelf just below the row of mobo's

[drezha]

Diskless is the way to go. CHeapper to run because you dont need an OS or hard drive for each machine. Which woks out cheaper to run as well because the HD uses a lot of energy.

Here's what you need
http://www.k12ltsp.org/

And Doubletop over at TPR has a guide on using it.
LTSP Diskless Farm Setup (http://forums.teamphoenixrising.net/showthread.php?t=31981)
Works very nice. He has about 20 nodes (or did have) on it crunching away. That can run BOINC and Folding@home. Not sure how to setup other mind.

Another guide here. (Folding only mind)
http://reilly.homeip.net/folding/

If your using XP already and dont want another PC to be the server, you can use windows network boot option. Again folding only but I'm sure you can find a way to do others.
http://reilly.homeip.net/folding/diskless.html

[jmblazek]

Thanks for all the advice and links! There was plenty for me to take in.

Now I need help in choosing the best (affordable) features in a new node. I know a lot depends on what I'll be crunching but I just want an overall idea of where not to skimp. If there are links out there that already answer these questions, please point me in the direction. Also, please excuse any senseless questions I may pose...I still don't know enough.:(

In a diskless system, I already know I need a good server, good networking, and fast, reliable storage i.e. RAID. For the most part I'll be running BOINC but would like capabilities to run non-BOINC applications.

For the node, I presume that raw crunching speed is the most important...right? The CPU is where the focus should be. The faster the better. Does 32bit and 64bit have much influence for crunching most projects? What about L1 and L2 cache? FSB? Is this the correct order of importance: CPU speed, L1/L2 cache, FSB. Is 32/64 bit irrelevant for the short term? Is there BOINC for 64 bit...and do any of the projects within BOINC make use of it?

Next most important is RAM and should match max FSB? Or can it be average speed RAM?

Third, motherboard. Cheapest available that matches FSB and has onboard networking, video... Most important features are FSB and networking??? And at least support for 1G RAM.

Finally, PSU...something adequate for the system. What's the minimum I can get away with...enough to support the MB and CPU without wasting too much electricity???

If y'all could offer advice on the best AMD and Intel CPUs that would be great. How about motherboards? Vaughan mentions Asrock 775-dual-VSTA for Intel. Any others? What about for AMD?

Here's what I'd like to get away with:

CPU $175
RAM $50 (512MB should be enough???)
MB $50
PSU $25
Total $300 US

I could even see going to $350 if the CPU needed the extra $50.

Notes: For Intel Core 2 Duo I notice that prices go up considerably when L2 cache goes from 2M to 4M. Does that make a significant difference in crunching? Also, for the $100 difference between the E6400 & E6600...is the .27GHz increase worth it? What about the Xeon's? Additionally, based on Tom's Hardware suggestions, looks like the E6300 can safely be overclocked to 2.45GHz. What role will overclocking be factured into the best bang for buck CPU?

With AMD there's many more choices as L1 & L2 cache changes a lot. If crunching power is greatly influenced by L1 & L2 cache here's where they will play a more significant role. What about the differences between 64, 64 X2, & Opteron?

Also, does anyone know of any boxes out there that support multiple PSUs and Motherboards?

Once again, thanks for all your help and advice!

p.s. Check out this guys setup...he was a truly a pioneer back in 2001!!!

http://www.nelliott.demon.co.uk/distributed/windows_diskless/index.html

Between his Windows98 DC Farm and the LTSP Screwball Farm, someone needs to come up with a more plug and play method. :)

[Nflight]

I will be surprised at the actual figure you do total everything up to when your finished. I would hope you can get under $300 a piece. I read over the dude from the 2001 Seti wall experience and was impressed.
If your like me and don't have the time to spend tinkering on putting these together anymore. I prefer a more direct route, just save up and go buy a server!
Microsoft has expressed an interest about 8 months ago I read an article about an OS call HPC which stands for High Powered Computing. I am in the unknow area if this type of software was actually released yet? Anyone....

[Bender10]

I had a PIII sitting around (dosen't everyone), so I turned it into a test server using K12LTSP, I installed v6.0 32bit. The install went ok. I'm sure I could have done a quicker install if I took the time to weed through the packages a little better. Just to get the minimum install.

I hope to get some time this weekend to try and get a client on the air. I only have a couple of MB's kicking around, and I hope one of them will werk.