Memory

[Anonymous]

just wondering if having more memory actually makes a difference to procesing speed. i have been through the faq on BOINC and predictor which says no (not after 256 anyway) just was gonna ask u BC as u seem to know pretty much everything predictor related
thx

[Beerknurd]

I wouldn't think that it would. 256 seems like it would be plenty. Of course I haven't had less than 512 in over 5 years. I've always been a RAM whore. I cram as much as I can into a machine. The MoBo I have now will hold up to 4 gigs. I can't afford that anyways..... I guess I'll have to be happy with 1 gig. Which is also plenty.

[BC]

Memory requirements:

win/98 needs 128mb to run min.... add 128 for Predictor
win/2k & XP needs 256mb ..... add 128 for predictor

add 128mb for good measure for other apps such as email, IE6


I run 1G for XP and 512MM-768MB for Win/2k


BC

[Beerknurd]

Or you can do what BC suggests. LOL. :)

[BC]

I believe I've said it... but will restate:

Windows 98 & 98/se themselves need a min of 128 MB of mem to run effectively. 256 is clearly preferred.

Windows 2000 Pro (not Server) needs a minimum of 256MB to do the same. I believe 'Server' needs a proper 512MB, but that is also a lot of wasted CPU time that most of us don't have unless it's a dual CPU machine.

Windows XP Home and Pro both need a MINIMUM of 256 MB to just get going. I would recommend that a proper 'base' for Win XP be 512MB.



Now, having said that. Predictor's MFOLD application requires 78MB of RAM to run when you include version 3.20 of BOINC (which is 3.5 MB of that). If you decide to run the graphics, you will need more, something around 85-90MB ... depends on settings, etc.

The Charmms application is smaller, but that is about to change, so I would keep the 78 from Mfold (let's call it 80 for easy math) for now.

This brings you essentially to another 128 MB stick if you are running at the bare minimums to start with.

None of this includes you running email or any chats or anything else. This starts chewing up things quick.


My configuration of XP Pro (at bare minimum) is 320MB actively in use by the time I am logged in w/ just Predictor running.... so the 512MB holds fairly well.


Here are some pro's & con's... With more memory, you spend less time writing to disk (disk slows you down) but at the price of memory and assuming your motherboard can hold it. With too much memory and a slow processor, Windows spends a lot of time looking through memory 'finding free space' (an internal cleanup flaw).


From personal experience with operating systems (developer and user), as well as knowing how microsoft will gobble up memory like it's candy...

I recommend the following unless you know 'exactly' how to control the Windows environment.

Win 98 & 98/se -- 256 without graphics.... 384 with. Target 512 (2x256)
Win 2k, XP home, Pro -- 512 without, 768 with, Target 1GB (2x512)
Win 2003 Server (aka XP Server) 1GB min.... Target 1.5 or 2GB
Linux 256-512MB period.
MAC 512+

This allows for disk read buffering, disk write buffering, and other applications to run without interfering too much (if at all) with Predictor or any other DC app.


Now, If you use another OS (MAC, Linux, or Unix), Apply the same deltas to the recommended baseline for that particular OS, and can ammend my numbers above.



To give you a heads up, MFold and Charms will be growing shortly to allow for the bigger / more complex proteins (like the T0235C errors we have been seeing). The code is about to become more dynamic and 'self memory allocating' instead of being based like a 'Fortran' (look it up) program.... (LOL... I used to write fortran and fortran compilers)...

So... If you can afford it... Not to recommend a brand... Fast PC's (X86 type) can use less costly Kingston with no problem. The fast machines like mine require the more costly stuff like OCZ and Corsair, but I still am running at 1GB. I have another 512MB of Corsair in the drawer and will install it with another 512 as soon as the next one arrives. Tthis gives me 2GB....


I am however doing just fine with a virus scanner, IE, Outlook, ... 43 processes in total (including boinc and Mfold) on 1GB of RAM.

So... 512-768MB target for win98 folks.... 512MB-1GB for 2K, XP, and 2003 for others, and Mac folks already know.... the Linux crows already knows EXACTLY what their needs are..... (Don't we??? LOL)


There is the 32 bit / 64 bit twist to all this, that we will discuss in another thread or at another time.




BC

[Empty_5oul]

k, excellent reply thx m8.
i upgraded my comp from an old motherboard to a new better one, nowASRock K7S8XE+. After reading the manual i find tho it says it can take DDR400 memory only one of the three slots can actually take this -- i have 2 512 DDR 400 sticks, should i try adding another of these to the comp?? Otherwise would it be better to buy another 512 DDR333 and add it with my old 512 ddr 333 stick to have a gig but slower.
your comments please

[chaz]

Your board will only run 1 slot in 400mhz mode, which is odd. Your DDR400 is backward compatible, so it should be just fine at 333mhz. You may have to adjust the memory speed manually in the bios, as it will probably try to autodetect it as DDR400.
So pretty much if you have a 333 mhz(166fsb)or slower cpu,and you use the 2 333mhz slots, you should be just fine. Another point also, you'll be able to overclock it without worrying about exceeding the limitations of your ram.

I think 1 stick of 512 will be enough anyway, unless youre doing some heavy duty stuff, like video rendering and such....the only machine I use more than 512mb of ram is in my dual cpu machine, and havent had any problems(except when I overclock :roll:, but thats my own fault). I do alot of gaming and some video rendering.

[Empty_5oul]

right...
i do a bit or flash, fireworks, dreamweaver and photoshop atm - but i want to get into doing 3d graphics, really i do want 1g of memory

my processor is an AMD Athlon XP 3200 (400MHz)

** i dont want to have memory running slower - thats what i had in my old machine but now i have some money i want proper speeds in proper slots lol.

is there any difference in speeds etc if i was to buy 2x512 sticks or 1gig stick??

[chaz]

It's not going to allow 2x512@400mhz, so if you want 1 GB of memory you have no choice but do buy a 1 GB stick, or run at 333mhz. This is only if the board has a divider to slow the ram speed to less than the CPU speed. I would try 512 and see what happens, you might be surprised. BTW what Operating System are you using?

2x512 would be faster with a dual channel board, yes. But that board wont do it, sorry.

[chaz]

In my own personal opinion, I think you'll be ok with 512mb, It wouldn't hurt to give it a try.
Given the cost of a 1GB stick of DDR400, since you already have 2-512's, it would be more cost effective and most likely faster to pick up an NF2 dual channel board for about 60 bucks like an AN35N-Ultra400, or a K7N2-Delta L, only thing is you'll be lacking RAID. I have both of these boards and they are pretty good for the cost(the Shuttle is better).

[Empty_5oul]

k , kool
shame bout the dual channel but nm. This wasnt the original board i bought cause i broke it during putting the heat sink on :(, hit a capacitor and didnt work - ill solder it sometime.
so would i see a difference of 1Gig 333 or 1Gig 400 - im assuming it would be minimal.
where u say u'd try 512 and see do u meen put my other 512stick in or something else :S

[chaz]

I just dl'ed the manual for that board, it doesnt have a divider. I dont think you will be able to run your DDR400 at 333mhz. You could try to stick your 400 in the 333 slots to get 1 GB if you want, but i dont know what it will do. It might just sit there and beep at you, it may slow your CPU to 333, hard to say.

I'd just try it with 1 single stick of 512 DDR400 and see how it runs for your applications, you might do just fine..

If not, 1GB DDR400 roundabout $200.
NForce2 cheapo board and your existing 2x512 in dual channel-$60.

[chaz]

43 processes BC? OMG you must have alot of crap on your puter.
I have 19 with XP Pro including Boinc, and MFold. 18 if I dont count Taskmanager.

[Empty_5oul]

i have beein running 512 for a while now and it seems ok but for example when i create somehting in flash it can often take 10secs or more when i do a full screen preview etc. -- really i want a gig.

i just looked at some suppliers (im trade aswell)- few do gig sticks. mircodirect does but many manufacturers do a gig package of 2x512 - obviously i would need 1x1,024 stick for it to work. this is the site http://www.microdirect.co.uk/ProductLister.aspx?GroupID=465
whats majorbrand like (costing only £89 exc VAT, £104 inc VAT for 1 gig) - will performance be much different as oppose to buying a named manufacturer

[chaz]

I dont know how much better the name brand stuff is speedwise, I usually get whatever is on sale, except in special instances. I dont really care if the high dollar stuff is 3 or 5% faster, as long as the system is stable I'm not gonna complain. Maybe If I was running 1 or 2 PC's I would take the time to see the difference........Some of the other guys could answer that better than I.

[Empty_5oul]

k thx for all the advice n downloading my manual etc.