Socket FM2 is (almost) there

[Dirk Broer]

Computex 2012 has begun, and amongst the new hardware shown there are the first FM2 mobo's.

ECS has introduced no less than five, the A85F2-A Deluxe (http://www.ecsusa.com/ECSWebSite/Media/NewsRoom_Detail.aspx?NewsID=1496&MenuID=45&LanID=0) (shown here) being their top model http://cdn.overclock.net/a/ad/560x338px-LL-ad2669de_A85F2-A_DeluxeA02.jpg.jpeg
Other models are the A75F2-A2, A75F2-M2, A55F2-A2 and A55F2-M3, M standing for micro ATX while the A models have the standard ATX layout.
Their FM1 mobo's support up to DDR3 2600 memory, let's hope that the FM2 takes over from there, Corsair just have brought out their new DDR3 3000 Dominator modules. I wouldn't know where to buy an ECS mobo at the moment though, living in the Netherlands. The ECS website names no dealer here.

Gigabyte has come with the GA-F2A85X-UP4 as their present top model (shown here), http://www.techpowerup.com/img/12-06-04/28a.jpg
Finally a Gigabyte Fusion FMx board that's in top-model colors! Other boards are the F2A55-DS3 and GA- F2A55M-DS2.


Note that some of these boards use the same A75 or A55 chipset as the earlier FM1 mobo's. No sign of an adapter/converter yet though.

[NeoGen]

I've been waiting to see how these motherboards and CPUs will play out, and how much will they cost.

If they are already being demo'ed at Computex then shouldn't be too long until they are out. :)

[Dirk Broer]

The upcoming FM2 socket boards come in a number of varieties, the most important of them being the chipset
You can choose between the A55, A75 and A85 chipset.

the A55 supports 6 x 3 Gbit/s SATA,
the A75 supports 6 x 6 Gbit/s SATA,
the A85 supports 8 x 6 Gbit/s SATA.

the A55 supports 14 USB 2.0 and 2 USB 1.1 ports,
the A75 and A85 support 4 USB 3.0, 10 USB 2.0 and 2 USB 1.1 ports

the A55 and A75 support RAID 0,1,10 and JBOD
the A85 supports RAID 0,1,5,10 and JBOD

So my advice is to look out for the A85 chipset when you buy a FM2 mobo, and for the A75 in case of the FM1.
An A55 board is for those tasks where SATA speed does not matter and nor does USB 3.0. Two slots of memory might even be enough then.

And that's another point of variety: the number of RAM slots, two or four. In case that you plan to do longer with your mobo,
it often is a sound advice to have it a bit upgradable, so spend that little bit extra now in order to be able to upgrade later, and take a board with four RAM slots
To be honest, 16 Gb modules are just around the corner, so a two memory slot FM2 mobo can still take 32 Gb of memory in the future. But be warned: that is the same logic that saw my two RAM slot Socket 775 DDR2 mobo being left with only 4Gb because it was way too expensive to upgrade it to 8 Gb. When it died I replaced it with a DDR3 mobo plus 8 Gb of DDR3 at 2/3 of the price of 8 Gb DDR2.

All around the internet people have started to wonder why there are full-size ATX FM1 and FM2 mobo's, and it beats me why, owning one. The advantage is clear: the extra slots, whether PCIe or plain old PCI.
Other people don't understand the PCIe slots, when it's more than one. They do not even seem to consider the possibility of (triple?) CrossfireX and think that people only buy Llano or Trinity systems to use them without discrete video card (I even couldn't with my F1A75!).

In the end it is your money when you buy a new mobo. But better safe than sorry, and better too many empty slots than too few.

[NeoGen]

Hmmm... the A85 chipset with 8 SATA-3 ports and a low power CPU might just be what I need for a future storage dedicated machine. :)

[Dirk Broer]

It may have escaped you, but the first Trinity-based desktop chips have been presented and can be ordered.
Funny variants though, as they're called FirePro A300 and FirePro A320 (http://www.amd.com/us/press-releases/Pages/amd-firepro-apu-2012aug7.aspx):icon_santa:http://img.x-drivers.ru/news/2012/839.jpg

By the first looks of it they seem to have a lot in common with the upcoming A10-5700 and A10-5800K (http://www.nordichardware.com/news/69-cpu-chipset/46345-amd-trinity-becomes-firepro-for-workstations-on-a-budget.html). The A300 has a tdp of 65Watt and runs at 3400Mhz, while the 384 shaders of it's GPU part run at 760 Mhz, just like the A10-5700. The A320 has a tdp of 100Watt and runs at 3800Mhz, while the 384 shaders of it's GPU part run at 800 Mhz, just like the A10-5800K.:icon_mrgreen:

What's the difference? The A300 and A320 run, for the time being, only on a Sapphire PGS (http://www.sapphirepgs.com/featurepage.asp?IDno=17&lang=eng) (Professional Graphics System) mobo and sport an awesome amount of double precision capability, 1/4th of their single precision capability! (remember that the double precision capability of the HD 77xx and HD 78xx has been cut to 1/16th):sad5:
The 173 (A300) and 184 GFlop (A320) DP are just below the DP value of my trusty old HD 4770 (sic!), but considerably higher than the HD 7750 (51,2), the HD 7770 (80), the HD 7850 (110,1) and the HD 7870 (160), and even outshine products like the nVidia GTX 680 (129) and all GTx 6xx below that card.:icon_lol:

It is to be expected that the DP capability of the Trinity chips will be cut to 1/16th, like the Radeon counterparts, if they have any DP capability at all (They are supposed to run along the yet to come HD 76xx/75xx/74xx for CrossfireX, and we know nothing about the DP capability of these cards either):help:

The A300 and A320 are capable of Dual Graphics (http://www.sapphirepgs.com/presentation/solution/?psn=000207&lid=14) and can be combined with the FirePro V3900 or FirePro V4900 (roughly comparable to respectively the HD 6570 and HD 6670, but supporting DP(?)).

[NeoGen]

I have been waiting for the low power embedded AMD R-Series (http://www.amd.com/us/products/embedded/processors/Pages/r-series.aspx) to appear somewhere for sale, I've been wanting to build my own little network media player (set top box style) and I would like to start off with a new platform and hopefully be able to be only passively cooled and totally silent. (The product brief shows several variants ranging from 17W to 35W TDP)

I know in this day and age no one needs to build their own media player set top box, they are for sale everywhere, but I want to have the hands-on experience and be able to support it in case of some hardware failure, instead of having to send it to the manufacturer and waiting several weeks for it to return.

[Dirk Broer]

Boards like the DFI CM901-B (http://www.dfi.com/products/ProductDetails.jsp?productId=664&mainCategoryId=2&categoryId=12&subCategoryId=12&productDetailsPage=false) you mean?

[NeoGen]

Yup, exactly like that. :) Unfortunately it is still showing as "Coming soon" on that website.
The pic they show seems to be from a board that was taken out of the manufacturing assembly in midway through the process... it's missing all the connectors (USB, VGA,etc) and possibly some more things.

[Dirk Broer]

Fully equipped, even an A75 chipset: the Mano111 (http://axiomtek.com/products/ViewProduct.asp?view=1014) http://axiomtek.com/Download/Photo/mano111_2.jpg

With A70 chipset: the Kontron KTA70M/mITX (http://emea.kontron.com/products/boards+and+mezzanines/embedded+motherboards/miniitx+motherboards/kta70mmitx.html) http://emea.kontron.com/images/imageprocessing.php?action=thumb&file=/images/products/3666/3666prod_kta70mmitx.jpg&thumbsize=350

[NeoGen]

I think I read about those 2 at some point in the past... Looking at them again now the Mano111 says "Status: Q3" and the KTA70M/mITX says "First samples of the new Kontron embedded Mini-ITX motherboard KTA70/mITX are available now and series production will start in Q4/2012." :(

[Jason1478963]

I looked at building a media PC for a while too. I ended up using one of the basement crunchers and added a 30 foot HDMI cable and used a Bluetooth keyboard to control it and VNC. I am now adding a 30 foot USB cable to connect a mouse and other useful devices near the TV. It makes a nice DVR with a network based tv tuner and windows 7 media center. It was cheaper then building a dedicated machine for me. It may also be worth looking into so you can crunch and keep the noise down :)

[Dirk Broer]

Considering that there are 400Watt fanless PSUs and SSDs, it should be possible to crunch with a AMD R-Series APU and hear -almost- nothing.
Combined with a passively cooled, low-profile HD 7670 it could be a real winner, both energy and noise wise.

[Jason1478963]

What is the deal with the RaspberryPI? Has anyone here tried or found interesting uses for them?

[NeoGen]

From what I remember reading about it that is a charity organization that makes some very cheap, and inexpensive tiny computers, little bigger than a credit card (but of course a bit thicker).
They have an ARM processor and something like 256Mb of RAM, run Linux and can be powered by AA batteries (or AC plug). By far NOT the most powerful thing out there but sufficient to plug to a monitor and have a very basic web browsing machine.
I think it's a great idea for underprivileged families and/or 3rd world countries where you don't have much access to technology, but I wouldn't be able to do anything with one myself.

[Dirk Broer]

If you want to crunch using ARM chips, this might be an option (http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/2199794/codethink-launches-32core-arm-server-using-marvell-chips)http://ic.tweakimg.net/ext/i/imagenormal/1345467290.jpeg

[vaughan]

What is the deal with the RaspberryPI? Has anyone here tried or found interesting uses for them?

My son bought one but I don't think he's done anything with it yet. Full of ideas to use it as a system monitor but nothing usable at the moment.

[AMDave]

The key goal for the device is to get kids interested in coding ... like we used to for the Beeb micro etc. 25 years ago. (we still have one in working order)
This is happening even down to the primary school level.
Games appear to be a great driver if kids can write and change the code themselves.

Many other folks who have managed to grab one have already found that it works well as an XBMC media center, except for MPEG-2 (which is being fixed) and VC1 which is now available.
http://www.raspberrypi.org/

Clocks, autonomous speedboats, robot arms, night vision, pretty much anything you can dream up can be driven by the RaPI.
With a DC battery power source and because of its size and weight, designs are quite flexible.
Check out some of the YouTube videos.

I read the other day about a kid writing ASM code to get a mini LCD panel working.
That's pretty cool and is the perfect outcome for the goals of the RaspberryPI.
(I can't find the article again just now but if I come across it again I'll drop the reference in here)

[Jason1478963]

this is an interesting device with many people coming up with great ideas. one that I found interesting was the solar/energy monitoring. There was mention to putting this in a laptop where the motherboard has died. I'm not sure this is worth the time and effort it may take but it is an interesting idea. I like the idea of the media player as they could easily be added to the back of a TV.

[Dirk Broer]

You've probably seen this one already, where someone managed to put a RaspberryPI in a keyboard (http://www.geeky-gadgets.com/raspberry-pi-keyboard-case-hack-23-08-2012/)

[AMDave]

10 coolest uses for the Raspberry Pi
http://www.techrepublic.com/blog/european-technology/10-coolest-uses-for-the-raspberry-pi/505

Case mods
http://www.makeuseof.com/tag/8-interesting-diy-raspberry-pi-case-ideas/

Security camera controller, Internet enabled power switch, rocrail controller, cluster, backup controller, +others
http://www.rpiforum.net/forum/forum/6-raspberry-pi-projects-ideas/

I haven't even read through the official community forums yet
http://www.raspberrypi.org/phpBB3/index.php

Summary of the ideas thread:
http://raspberrypihacks.com/raspberry-pi-hacks/some-of-the-best-raspberry-pi-ideas-and-uses-ive-seen-so-far/

The Raspberry Pi latop you were talking about:
http://www.raspberrypi.org/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=63&t=6747

[AMDave]

Smallest FM2 motherboard at the moment might be MSI A85IA-E53
http://www.pcper.com/news/Motherboards/Computex-MSI-Unveils-Four-New-AMD-Trinity-FM2-Socket-Motherboards
" shallow in depth and is meant to be used in living room HTPCs."

[Dirk Broer]

This ITX board might be even smaller, or at least of the same size (http://www.htpc-reviews.com/more-fm2-boards-for-trinity-zotac-stands-out-with-its-mini-itx-model-computex-2012) Zotac A75-ITX WiFi
http://www.htpc-reviews.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/Zotac_A75-ITX-600x400.jpg
And here another contender (2nd board from above) (http://www.coolenjoy.net/bbs/cboard.php?id=25&no=1763&page=3&num=1483&board=25&ss=&sc=&sn=&keyword=&qa=&ga=&cat=&vote=) Sapphire Pure Platinum A75T -and look at the low-profile HD 7750 below!
http://files.coolenjoy.net/SWFUpload/demos/resizedemo/saved/8f5c1f91a449500c74da1a6268fc3bae.jpg

[Dirk Broer]

Asrock FM2 Motherboard page. Fourteen(!) boards here, five A85 based. (http://www.asrock.com/mb/index.asp?s=FM2)
ASUS motherboards page. Ten FM2 boards to be found, five A55 and five A85 boards. (http://www.asus.com/Motherboards/)
Biostar FM2 motherboard page, with 11 boards, four Hi-Fi A85 boards amongst them (http://www.biostar.com.tw/app/en/mb/index.php?S_ID=18) Look at the CPU Support List!
ECS FM2 motherboard page, six boards, two per chipset, the A85 boards (http://www.ecs.com.tw/ECSWebSite/Product/Product_Model.aspx?CategoryID=1&TypeID=110&MenuID=154&childid=M_7&LanID=0), A85F2-A DELUXE (http://www.ecs.com.tw/ECSWebSite/Product/Product_Detail.aspx?DetailID=1368&CategoryID=1&DetailName=Feature&MenuID=154&LanID=0) and even more classy A85F2-A GOLDEN (http://www.ecs.com.tw/ECSWebSite/Product/Product_Detail.aspx?DetailID=1426&CategoryID=1&DetailName=Feature&MenuID=154&LanID=0)
All quiet on the Foxconn (http://www.techpowerup.com/167196/Foxconn-Channel-A85AP-Socket-FM2-Motherboard-Pictured.html) front
Gigabyte FM2 motherboard page, with 10 boards: three A55, three A75 and four A85 (http://www.gigabyte.com/products/list.aspx?s=42&jid=10&p=2&v=29)
Jetway FM2 Motherboard page. Three boards here, two A85. (http://www.jetway.com.tw/jw/motherboard_socket.asp?platid=47)
MSI page with 5 boards: two A55, two A75 and one A85 (http://www.msi.com/product/mb/#/?sk=Socket%20FM2)
Sapphire FM2 board page with one A85 board, PURE Platinum A85X, so far (http://www.sapphiretech.com/presentation/product/?cid=2&gid=1181&sgid=1182&pid=0&psn=000101&lid=1&leg=0) (But where can we get the Sapphire PGS (http://www.sapphirepgs.com/presentation/media/?psn=0003&articleid=457&lid=1) with FirePro APU? Can we get it at all? It's supposed to be OEM)
Zotac split their mobo's not on sockets, but on chipsets. They have two FM2 ITX boards: ZOTAC A75-ITX WiFi B Series (http://www.zotac.com/index.php?page=shop.product_details&flypage=flypage_images-SRW.tpl&product_id=510&category_id=150&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=100270&lang=em) and ZOTAC A55-ITX WiFi B Series (http://www.zotac.com/index.php?page=shop.product_details&flypage=flypage_images-SRW.tpl&product_id=514&category_id=155&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=100321&lang=em)

[Dirk Broer]

What makes a FM2 board a good board? From a cruncher's point of view I'd say that it's pretty much the same as the criteria I'd use for a FM1 board:

* Support for 4 sticks of RAM, so you do not run out of memory. Not now, never, even when doing 4 BURP WUs at a time.
* The most versatile chipset possible, here the A85 (where the A75 was the best choice for FM1), so you can e.g. have RAID5, USB3 and SATA3.
* At least two slots for discrete graphic cards, so you can go for triple crossfire, together with your APU or do SLI with two nVidia cards.
* d-Sub (VGA), DVI, HDMI and Displayport connectors, so that the board can even be used without discrete graphics and not be hampered by a missing connector.
* eSATA support, for them external goodies.
* Support for LucidLogix Virtu MVP, especially if you want to tinker around with nVidia cards.
* Rock-solid power design, with preferably at least 8 (6 APU+2 RAM) phases, so overclocking is safer.

Si far the next boards made the cut, or did it almost:
Asrock: The FM2A85 Extreme 6 (http://www.asrock.com/mb/AMD/FM2A85X%20Extreme6/) supports LucidLogix Virtu MVP. The power design has a 8+2 phase VRM.
Asus: The F2A85-V PRO (http://www.asus.com/Motherboards/AMD_Socket_FM2/F2A85V_PRO/#specifications) supports LucidLogix Virtu MVP. The power design has a 6+2 phase VRM.
Biostar: The Hi-Fi A85X (http://www.biostar.com.tw/app/en/mb/introduction.php?S_ID=616) supports LucidLogix Virtu MVP. The power design has a 8+2 phase VRM.
ECS: It is unclear yet whether -but likely that- A85F2-A DELUXE (http://www.ecs.com.tw/ECSWebSite/Product/Product_Detail.aspx?DetailID=1368&CategoryID=1&DetailName=Feature&MenuID=154&LanID=0) and even more classy A85F2-A GOLDEN (http://www.ecs.com.tw/ECSWebSite/Product/Product_Detail.aspx?DetailID=1426&CategoryID=1&DetailName=Feature&MenuID=154&LanID=0) support LucidLogix Virtu MVP. The power design falls short though, as it only has a 4+1 phase VRM.
Foxconn: The A85AP also seems to fall short on the power design phases, having a 5+1 phase VRM.
Gigabyte: The GA-F2A85X-UP4 (http://www.gigabyte.com/products/product-page.aspx?pid=4343#sp) has a 6+2 phase digi VRM design. It also supports LucidLogix Virtu MVP.
Jetway: The Jetway HA20-85X (http://www.jetway.com.tw/jw/motherboard_view.asp?productid=1013&proname=HA20-85X) has three PCIe x16 slots, and the power design has a 8+2 phase VRM. No mentioning of LucidLogix Virtu MVP though.
MSI: Unclear whether the FM2-A85XA-G65 (http://www.msi.com/product/mb/FM2-A85XA-G65.html#/?div=Overview)supports LucidLogix Virtu MVP. It does have a 8+2 phase hybrid digital VRM.
Sapphire: Unclear whether the Sapphire Pure Platinum A85XT (http://www.sapphiretech.com/presentation/product/?cid=2&gid=1181&sgid=1182&pid=1477&psn=&lid=1&leg=0) supports LucidLogix Virtu MVP. It has a 8+2 phase VRM design.
Zotac: None yet.

[NeoGen]

I wish companies would produce consumer motherboards with more than 4 memory slots... I like that feature on server motherboards but I don't want to pay hundreds more for it and be locked in the server platform and components only. (and their outrageous prices!)
Part for part I have been slowly building myself a couple of home servers (Storage and VMware, neither one complete yet), but I am building them with standard components, micro ATX form factor and... I wish I wasn't capped at 32Gb of RAM.

[Dirk Broer]

Some FM1 boards do support 64 Gb, but you have to fill them with not-yet-existing 16 Gb sticks in order to get 64 Gb....
Some of those boards are micro ATX as well, such as the Gigabyte GA-A75M-UD2H (needs a BIOS Update to F5 though)

People who can afford it bought Socket 1366 mobo's (six memory slots) and are now buying Socket 2011 mobo's (eight memory slots)
It would indeed be nice if there were AM3+ boards that would also have six or eight slots...

[Dirk Broer]

The Asrock FM2A85X Extreme 6 gets favorably reviewed by Techwarelabs (http://www.techwarelabs.com/asrock-fm2a85x-extreme-6-motherboard-review/all/1)
AnandTech (http://www.anandtech.com/show/6360/asus-f2a85v-pro-review-a-look-at-fm2-with-a85x) has posted (on 10-10 already) a review of the ASUS F2A85-V PRO, one of the FM2 boards of choice (able to support Quad CrossFireX). While not overly enthusiastic, the article nicely sums up all the specs of the board.
Biostar's Hi-Fi A85X is reviewed by OCWorkbench (http://en.ocworkbench.com/tech/review-of-biostar-hi-fi-a85x-socket-fm2-trinity-motherboard-with-a10-5800k-processor/)
ECS has their ECS A85F2-A Golden critically reviewed (say:clobbered) by AnandTech (http://www.anandtech.com/show/6626/ecs-a85f2a-golden-review-all-that-glitters)
The Gigabyte GA-F2A85X-UP4 got a review from the HiTechLegion (http://www.hitechlegion.com/reviews/motherboards/31670-gig-f2a85xup4-review?showall=&limitstart=) and from Vortez (http://www.vortez.net/articles_pages/gigabyte_ga_f2a85x_up4_review,1.html)
MSI's FM2-A85XA-G65 is reviewed by eTeknix (http://www.eteknix.com/reviews/motherboards/msi-fm2-a85xa-g65-a85x-motherboard-review/)
Sapphire's Pure Platinum A85XT also got reviewed by eTeknix (http://www.eteknix.com/reviews/motherboards/sapphire-pure-platinum-a85xt-a85x-motherboard-review/)

[Dirk Broer]

While I am a big fan of ATX boards, some prefer the more compact μATX format.

What were the criteria for a good FM2 board?
* Support for 4 sticks of RAM, so you do not run out of memory. Not now, never, even when doing 4 BURP WUs at a time.
* The most versatile chipset possible, here the A85 (where the A75 was the best choice for FM1), so you can e.g. have RAID5, USB3 and SATA3.
* At least two slots for discrete graphic cards, so you can go for triple crossfire, together with your APU or do SLI with two nVidia cards.
* d-Sub (VGA), DVI, HDMI and Displayport connectors, so that the board can even be used without discrete graphics and not be hampered by a missing connector.
* eSATA support, for them external goodies.
* Support for LucidLogix Virtu MVP, especially if you want to tinker around with nVidia cards.
* Rock-solid power design, with preferably at least 8 (6 APU+2 RAM) phases, so overclocking is safer.

Which mobo's will pass these criteria?
Asrock: FM2A85X Extreme4-M (http://www.asrock.com/mb/AMD/FM2A85X%20Extreme4-M/?cat=Specifications)
* Four RAM slots? Yes, up to 64 Gb (4x16Gb).
* A85 chipset? Yes.
* d-Sub (VGA), DVI, HDMI and Displayport connectors? Lacks Displayport.
* eSATA support? Yes.
* Support for LucidLogix Virtu MVP? No.
* Rock-solid power design, with preferably at least 8 (6 APU+2 RAM) phases, so overclocking is safer? Comes with 4+2 Power Phase Design.

ASUS: F2A85-M PRO (http://www.asus.com/Motherboards/AMD_Socket_FM2/F2A85M_PRO/#specifications)
* Four RAM slots? Yes, up to 64 Gb (4x16Gb).
* A85 chipset? Yes.
* d-Sub (VGA), DVI, HDMI and Displayport connectors? Yes.
* eSATA support? Yes.
* Support for LucidLogix Virtu MVP? Yes.
* Rock-solid power design, with preferably at least 8 (6 APU+2 RAM) phases, so overclocking is safer? Comes with 4+2 Power Phase Design.

BioStar: Hi-Fi A85S3 (http://www.biostar.com.tw/app/en/mb/introduction.php?S_ID=625#spec)
* Four RAM slots? No, two with up to 32 Gb (2x16Gb).
* A85 chipset? Yes.
* d-Sub (VGA), DVI, HDMI and Displayport connectors? Lacks DVI and Displayport.
* eSATA support? No.
* Support for LucidLogix Virtu MVP? No.
* Rock-solid power design, with preferably at least 8 (6 APU+2 RAM) phases, so overclocking is safer? Comes with 4+1 Power Phase Design.

ECS: no A85 μATX board, and their A75 μATX board only supports two sticks of RAM.

Foxconn: To the best of my knowledge not a single FM2 board ready to be bought.

Gigabyte: GA-F2A85XM-D3H (http://www.gigabyte.com/products/product-page.aspx?pid=4383#sp)
* Four RAM slots? Yes, up to 64 Gb (4x16Gb).
* A85 chipset? Yes.
* d-Sub (VGA), DVI, HDMI and Displayport connectors? Lacks Displayport.
* eSATA support? No.
* Support for LucidLogix Virtu MVP? No.
* Rock-solid power design, with preferably at least 8 (6 APU+2 RAM) phases, so overclocking is safer? unclear.

Jetway: They have two FM2 μATX boards, the A75 equipped HZ07-85 (http://www.jetway.com.tw/jw/motherboard_view.asp?productid=1017&proname=HZ07-85) being their best offer.

MSI: no A85 μATX board. They do have a A75 FM2 board though, the FM2-A75MA-E35 (http://nl.msi.com/product/mb/FM2-A75MA-E35.html#/?div=Detail).

Sapphire: no A85 μATX board, the name Sapphire Pure White A55 (http://www.sapphiretech.com/presentation/product/?cid=2&gid=1181&sgid=1184&pid=0&psn=&lid=1&leg=0) says it all for this μATX board.

Zotac: To the best of my knowledge not a single μATX FM2 board ready to be bought. Zotac are real ITX specialists.

Based upon these specs, I declare the ASUS board the winner of this review. If the various brands of motherboards want a more extensive review, they can send their boards to me in order to be properly tested.

[Dirk Broer]

And what to expect in the ITX format? Suppose you want to build a HTPC set and you think the afore mentioned μATX boards are too big for the casing you have in mind. What can you find on the net/in the store?

Asrock: FM2A85X ITX (http://www.pctreiber.net/2012/asrock-plant-a85-itx-board-fm2a85x-itx.html#)
* Four RAM slots? What do you think? On an ITX board? Two is all you get, for a maximum memory of 32Gb (2x16Gb).
* A85 chipset? Yes.
* d-Sub (VGA), DVI, HDMI and Displayport connectors? Lacks DVI and Displayport.
* eSATA support? Yes.
* Support for LucidLogix Virtu MVP? Don't think so.
* Rock-solid power design, with preferably at least 8 (6 APU+2 RAM) phases, so overclocking is safer? Unclear, but I'd expect at most a 4+1 power design on any ITX board.
You can ask yourself whether an ITX board setup really needs a A85 chipset. If the A75 suits you equally well Asrock has the similairly equipped FM2A75M-ITX (http://www.asrock.com/mb/AMD/FM2A75M-ITX/?cat=Specifications) for you.

ASUS: No A85 ITX yet, nor any other FM2 ITX board.

Biostar: No A85 ITX yet, nor any other FM2 ITX board.

ECS: No A85 ITX yet, nor any other FM2 ITX board.

Foxconn: To the best of my knowledge not a single FM2 board ready to be bought.

Gigabyte: GA-F2A85XN-WIFI (http://www.gigabyte.eu/products/product-page.aspx?pid=4611#ov)
* Four RAM slots? What do you think? Two is all you get, for a maximum memory of 32Gb (2x16Gb).
* A85 chipset? Yes.
* d-Sub (VGA), DVI, HDMI and Displayport connectors? Lacks d-Sub (VGA) and Displayport, but has two HDMI ports.
* eSATA support? No.
* Support for LucidLogix Virtu MVP? Is not mentioned.
* Rock-solid power design, with preferably at least 8 (6 APU+2 RAM) phases, so overclocking is safer? Unclear, but I'd expect at most a 4+1 power design on any ITX board.
To top it off this motherboard features Wi-Fi 802.11 a/b/g/n, supporting 2.4/5 GHz Dual-Band and Bluetooth 4.0, 3.0+HS, 2.1+EDR.

Jetway: To the best of my knowledge no ITX FM2 board.

MSI: no A85 ITX board (the MSI A85IA-E53) yet, but the A75 equipped FM2-A75IA-E53 (http://www.msi.com/product/mb/FM2-A75IA-E53.html#/?div=Detail)
* Four RAM slots? Two is all you get, for a maximum memory of 32Gb (2x16Gb).
* A85 chipset? No, the A75.
* d-Sub (VGA), DVI, HDMI and Displayport connectors? Lacks DVI and Displayport.
* eSATA support? Yes.
* Support for LucidLogix Virtu MVP? Don't think so.
* Rock-solid power design, with preferably at least 8 (6 APU+2 RAM) phases, so overclocking is safer? Unclear, but I'd expect at most a 4+1 power design on any ITX board.
BTW: this mobo has both Bluetooth and WiFi!

Sapphire: no A85 ITX yet, nor any other FM2 ITX board (e.g. the Sapphire Pure Platinum A75T).

Zotac: no A85 ITX, but the ZOTAC A75-ITX WiFi B (http://www.zotac.com/mx/products/mainboards/amd-cpu/product/amd-cpu/detail/a75-itx-wifi-b-series/sort/crdate/order/DESC/amount/10/section/specifications.html) is ready to be bought.
* Four RAM slots? Two is all you get, for a maximum memory of 32Gb (2x16Gb).
* A85 chipset? No, the A75.
* d-Sub (VGA), DVI, HDMI and Displayport connectors? Lacks Displayport.
* eSATA support? No.
* Support for LucidLogix Virtu MVP? Don't think so.
* Rock-solid power design, with preferably at least 8 (6 APU+2 RAM) phases, so overclocking is safer? Unclear, but I'd expect here too at most a 4+1 power design.
BTW: this mobo has also both Bluetooth and WiFi!

To quote Kevin Bruce Francisco & Kenny Yeo (http://www.hardwarezone.com.ph/tech-news-zotacs-mini-itx-motherboards-and-more) "Although FM2 motherboards have been spotted aplenty at Computex, it will be some time yet before we get to see AMD's desktop Trinity APUs in the market."

Based upon the specs -and your preferences for chipset and/or eSata- Gigabyte, MSI and Zotac each may have a winner with their Bluetooth and WiFi equipped GA-F2A85XN-WIFI (http://www.gigabyte.eu/products/product-page.aspx?pid=4611#ov), MSI FM2-A75IA-E53 (http://www.msi.com/product/mb/FM2-A75IA-E53.html#/?div=Detail) (with eSATA support) and the ZOTAC A75-ITX WiFi B (http://www.zotac.com/index.php?page=shop.product_details&flypage=flypage_images-SRW.tpl&product_id=510&category_id=150&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=100270&lang=en) (with HDMI).

[Nflight]

Impressive Reporting there Dirk, Thank You :blob3:

[Dirk Broer]

FM2 ATX boards Review from Tom's Hardware. (http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/socket-fm2-motherboard-review,3337.html)
Tom agrees with me on most favorite boards -The ASUS F2A85-V PRO and the Asrock FM2A85 Extreme 6-, but for more elaborate reasons. As he states "Asus provides the best overclocking on its exorbitantly-priced F2A85-V Pro, while ASRock offers the best price on its FM2A85X Extreme6, which doesn't overclock as well. Charting performance-per-dollar might it easier for some folks to choose a winner, but we also need to discuss the feature set each platform offers at its price point."


So what makes the Asrock FM2A85 Extreme 6 tick, according to Tom?
* It had the highest number (10) of phases in the voltage regulator module (like i wrote: The power design has a 8+2 phase VRM. BTW: As has the Biostar HI-Fi A85X, but their board was not included in the review). ECS is the only one here to stick out with it's mere five phases.
* It had a shared highest number of PCIe-16 slots, 3 (x16/x0/x4 or x8/x8/x4). MSI and ECS fail a bit here, 'only' offering two (x16/x0 or x8/x8), and thus limiting a cruncher to a triple APU/HD 6670 setup. But the cruncher can also decide to fit in two HD 7790s, or better.
* It has a shared highest number of fan pinout points (6).
* It has a diagnostics panel (as have the Gigabyte and Sapphire boards).
# It has the best sound chip (together with the Biostar HI-Fi A85X)

And what might be the unique selling points of the ASUS F2A85-V PRO?
* It had a shared highest number of PCIe-16 slots, 3 (x16/x0/x4 or x8/x8/x4).
* It's fan pinout points (5) are all 4-pin. (as with the Gigabyte mobo)
* It is the best overclockable board in the review.

[Dirk Broer]

While Trinity is hardly out of it's diapers, AMD will release it's successor, Richland (http://www.cpu-world.com/news_2013/2013012601_Specifications_of_upcoming_Richland_APU s.html) somewhere in the latter half of 2013.

[NeoGen]

And I saw on Tom's Hardware that the Radeon 8000 series is going to be delayed probably until end of this year :-(

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/Radeon-Delay-GeForce-HD8000,20979.html

[Dirk Broer]

And AMD needs a new series of cards to keep up with the 600-series from nVidia, that has made an impressive leap in the Flop/Watt ratio
(luckily the DP performance of the 600-series stinks to high heaven, especially the top models when compared with their AMD competitors).
But in the meantime I am waiting for the rumoured HD 7790 to come out.

[vaughan]

My son managed to get our latest box running Linux to play happily with the AMD drivers so we have a 7900 series card running Milkywayathome now. I cannot recall if its a 7950 or 7970 and remote login from my Win 7 notebook to a Gentoo box is something I don't know how to do.
The CPU in rack10 (original name huh?) is, dare I say it, an Intel I5-3570K. They are fast, overclock well, run cooler than Sandy Bridge and are reasonably priced. The mobo is an Asrock Z77 Extreme9, 32GB Corsair vengeance 1600 low profile ram, Corsair 860W platinum p/s, Corsair 80i water cooling. Norco-470 4U server rack case. Lots of Noctua fans to keep it cool and quiet!!!
The plan is to eventually get a second AMD gpu in there so we have a descent modern BOINC gobbler I mean cruncher.

[Dirk Broer]

On the other end of the graphical spectrum my son reports that his AGP HD 3850 can no longer can contribute to Boinc.
Anytime the GPU gets started (for Moo! or Collatz) his systems reboots spontaniously.

[Jason1478963]

On the other end of the graphical spectrum my son reports that his AGP HD 3850 can no longer can contribute to Boinc.
Anytime the GPU gets started (for Moo! or Collatz) his systems reboots spontaniously.

It could be something is failing like the power supply. If its a few years old they sometimes develop bad caps and have trouble with bigger loads. Its something that is fairly easy to swap out to test.

[AMDave]

My advice is to lay off the Catalyst 13.1 and 13.2 beta drivers for linux.
They are not stable even on clean fully updated installs.
I have found 4 repeatable issues - 3 are boot killers and one is an Xrandr issue that prevents you from using multiple monitors on multiple GPUs.
The first was Plymouth crash.
The second was Compiz.
The third was Xrandr.
And the finale is complete spontaneous system crash and freeze while the screen is blanked after specified time of no activity.
That was enough for me after about 20 install iterations ( Nutz? Yes. well I was testing after all :) )
The last 4 days have been memorable.
I have rolled back to Catalyst 12.10 and things are playing nicely again.
A quick web search finds much evidence of the same sorts of symptoms being experienced in the wild.
The Xrandr issue is just annoying. There could be a workaround for it, but I could only get both monitors on separate GPUs to activate if I enabled Xinerama, but when I did so, the system only reported 1 GPU installed and available to programs even though both monitors are working from separate GPUs.

I did also exercise the Catalyst 13.1 driver for the older HD cards on one box. Same sort of initial issues but the killer was the spontaneous lock-ups again.
Back to the generic OSS driver on that box as 12.10 does not work on it.

I actually hope that they 'pull' that version of the linux driver from their site. There's just to much bad going on with it.

edit - important note - I did not test the 32 bit versions of the drivers, only the 64 bit versions. I don't have sufficient reason to test 32 bit anymore.

[Dirk Broer]

While Trinity is hardly out of it's diapers, AMD will release it's successor, Richland (http://www.cpu-world.com/news_2013/2013012601_Specifications_of_upcoming_Richland_APU s.html) somewhere in the latter half of 2013.

And the good news is that Richland has the Radeon HD 8000 series aboard, capable -like the FirePro APUs- of double precision, so you can have yourself a very low-cost and efficient cruncher by buying the 65 Watt A10-6700 APU and get a MilkyWay capable card (both Double Precision and OpenCL) for free. Now to find out what the best Radeon card is to run alongside Richland, or save for that HD 7790 anyway...

[Dirk Broer]

And just now when Richland is launched, details about Kaveri leak out. There's good news and there is bad.
The good news is that the GPU performance of Kaveri will be in the HD 7770-7790 region.

The bad news is that it comes with a new chipset series(A68/A78/A88X) and a new Socket, FM2+.
We lucky sods however can keep dropping our Trinity or Richland APUs in Socket FM2+,
but you can't drop a Kaveri in the present FM2 boards as Kaveri uses two more pins..
http://cdn4.wccftech.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/FM2-Socket-635x394.jpg

[Dirk Broer]

Prices of the top FM2 boards have suddenly dropped significantly here in the Netherlands, Gigabyte's GA-F2A85X-UP4 now going for prices as low as 77 Euros (was 119 at a time) and Asrock's FM2A85X Extreme6 going for 86 Euros (was 106). Only ASUS still thinks to be able to cash in on the F2A85-V Pro (119 Euro's, was 135 ) and Sapphire has lost its marbles; the Pure Platinum F2A85X still being offered for 124 Euro's.
No doubt the coming of the FM2+ boards (https://www.asus.com/Motherboards/AMD_Platform_Products/) is the reason the older FM2 boards are dumped right now. Now for the FM2 APUs....I wouldn't mind buying a Trinity A10 at a lower price than there're offered now (105 Euro's)

[Dirk Broer]

As was to be expected: the prices of FM2 mobo's dropped because of the advent of FM2+ mobo's.
After a host of Kabini iTX mobo's from Asrock, ASUS, ECS, Sapphire (http://technewspedia.com/asrock-asus-ecs-msi-and-sapphire-show-their-cards-based-mini-itx-kabini-ctx2013/) and two ASUS FM2+ μATX mobo's, of which one with the new A88 chipset (http://www.asus.com/Motherboards/A88XMA/)) now also Gigabyte has shown their new FM2+ offerings:
The here now suddenly quite affordable http://www.gigabyte.eu/fileupload/product/2/4343/7212_m.jpg has to go for http://images.anandtech.com/doci/7227/130816_01_678x452.jpg
with a much more pronounced heatsink solution, while this one is entirely new:
http://images.anandtech.com/doci/7227/G1_SNIPER_A88X.jpg
If it features Lucid Virtu™ Universal® MVP GPU virtualization support you can combine a nVidia video card with an AMD one -at least under Windows- and get the best of both worlds. The PCIe slots already have a perfectly matching color for an nVidia card, and here are the matching memory sticks (http://cache.megatechnews.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/Patriot-Memory-Viper-3-Green.jpg)...

These two Gigabyte mobos form the top of the Gigabyte FM2+ offerings, others are:

F2A88X-D3H
F2A88X-HD3
F2A88XM-D3H
F2A85XM-DS2
F2A88XM-HD3